SocketSite™

The entire top floor has 9,500 sf at 11,000,000 translates to 1,157 psf, not quite the $2,000 that was projected, for whatever thats worth.

[Editor's Note: Mea culpa, that should have read "an unfinished" not "the entire" (which puts it around $2,300/sqft).]

The vast majority of contract holders plan on paying cash.

wow... that is interesting. it is amazing the amount of wealth that exists!

However, given the problems in the Jumbo market right now, it does make a certain amount of sense. perhaps those who need loans are hindered right now, whereas those who can pay in cash aren't. I wonder if Millenium will start selling faster if/when the jumbo market recovers...

98% of the contract holders are from the Bay Area (which doesn’t include France).

ROFL. A little snarkiness in the morning! I like it... I mean "je l'aime! c'est vachement hyper-drole"

70% of the contract holders are planning on making Millennium their primary residence

in other words, other places in the city may open up due to Millenium... I have always stated that the best way to improve SF affordability is to build new construction! Now about those trees...

"70% of the contract holders are planning on making Millennium their primary residence."

Translation: 70% of the people have told the loan officer to give them the lower rate for primary residences, regardless of their plans.

tipster,

Based on taking the data at face value, I have to disagree. If "the vast majority" of buyers are paying cash, then I would assume that they have not filled out any type of loan documents where they would fudge the truth to get a "lower rate."

70% are going to make Millennium their primary residence - that's fabulous news! I hope they'll join us in the Rincon Hill Neighborhood Association :)

A couple of amusing things about the interactive website (given that the actual view from almost all of the north-facing units includes the bulky office building across the street at Five Fremont Center, which at 600 feet is virtually the same height as Millennium):

1. Click on all of the units from Floor 26 to the penthouse and look at the "virtual views" - you'll never see Five Fremont Center even if you look at the view from every unit all the way around the building - oops did the camera accidently point to the side or something?

2. Click on Unit "A" on Floors 25 and below - and finally you will see Five Fremont Center - but magically it has turned into a triangular flatiron building that barely obstructs your view!! Thank you Adobe, Photoshop is amazing isn't it. And all along I thought Fremont Street was perpendicular to Mission Street, but now I see that intersection has a sharp angle! All of the other views seem honest, but this image has clearly been digitally manipulated. (Sorry I can't send an actual link since the site itself is Adobe Flash)

Here is John King's original article praising the building from four years ago - I agree with its sentiments - but wish that the interactive website were a bit more honest with regard to the northern views.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2003/12/21/MNG8H3RVSB1.DTL

Can't..Name:

You obviously didn't spend any part of your career in marketing communications like I did! Hoo boy, you should have seen the stunts that got pulled. And if we were essentially a temporary sales operation that was going to self destruct at a future time, like any sales office at a residential development, it would have been a lot worse!

Here's a sample form they might have used:

Check one:

-Please hound me endlessly with marketing pitches for financing at above market rates; or

-No thanks, I'm "planning" to pay cash.
--------
When the purchasers check the second one, they announce, Hey everyone, a majority of the buyers intend to pay in cash!

These "facts" are not being released as a public service: they are being released to sell more units. Period. Got it? Their job is not to educate you or perform any public service, their job is to sell you units. They are going to slant every thing they can in a manner that will make it seem the most desirable place on the planet.

That's their job. There's nothing wrong with that. It's your job to use your head and recognize their motivations may not always align with yours, and while they may or may not be fibbing, they are most certainly slanting the truth in a way that will sell the most units.

The same guys who are photoshopping out entire buildings are the ones releasing these "facts". Care to rephrase your "taking the facts at face value" statement?

Anyone else have issues with the wide stripe going diagonally down the building? In the mockups, they make the building look like it only has one color of glass. Definitely detracts from the potential sleekness, in my opinion.

Nevermind. Just checked the mockups and that "stripe" is clearly there. I just assumed it was the angle or something. How gaudy.

tipster,

Nope. Not until Socketsite states that the data they stated specifically came from a salesperson employed by the Millennium sales office. In that case, I agree with you. But, when you read the text, it says nowhere that the information came from the sales office or anybody associated with the project. It could have come from just about anywhere. "Face value is exactly that - face value, an assumption until factually proven correct or incorrect. I never mentioned that face value equals truth.

I have to say, it seems to me one of the best run sales offices we've seen in SF. My favorite part is how after doing a tour of the model, a door opens up that leads you straight into the closing room. It's an absolutely seamless transition from tour to contract.

I was just glancing at the renderings and was struck how the mid-rise looks like an ugly stepchild next to the tower - kind of squat, bulky, and graceless. I'm hoping I'm wrong because the tower is so striking, and it deserves a better neighbor.

Is it an "All Cash" purchase or will there be a loan involved at the time of the close of the escrow?

When a Buyer makes an offer at the Millennium or any property, they will find that the Seller prefers an "All Cash" offer which does not call for a loan condition, loan appraisal or loan credit issues.

Buyers, when they make their offer to purchase, subject to a loan condition, are not the preferred buyer, as most of you know today, even the most credit worthy buyers may not get the loan that his/her lender told them they could get!!!!

An "All Cash" Buyer, can still place a loan on the property and close the escrow, the Seller, believes that from the Purchase Contract, there is no loan and the offer is "All Cash".

So there may be some type of financing placed on the property, usually for tax purposes, but the Buyer has probably provided satisfactory information to the Seller that the Buyer can pay "All Cash".

As I wrote last year The Millennium will replace 2006 Washington St as the preferred address in San Francisco for those that can afford it!!!!.

Particularly when you can walk across the street and take the "TVG" to Beverly Hills in 2+ hours.

For those of you watching the Sea Wall Lot bidding for AT&T Parking lot A, how tall will the tallest building on that lot be? 20 stories, 40 stories or ??? There is no zonning height, placed on the proposals by the Port!!!

Frederick

@Frederick

While I want a high speed rail as much as anyone, the chances of it happening now are slim to none. Have you seen California's balance sheet? The feds won't finance that thing all by themselves. Not to mention the closest you'd get to Beverly Hills would be Union Station in Downtown LA.

Frederick
Suggest you check the height limit with Aaron Peskin
Bill

All these rich people are making me depressed. Anyone know of a good, working "get rich quick pyramid scheme"?

the buyers HAVE to pay cash. new internal bank limits lending to buyers unless > 60% of a development sold. they CANT get a mortgage because only 15% of this development sold. right?

Particularly when you can walk across the street and take the "TVG" to Beverly Hills in 2+ hours.

Hey!!! Is that a barb at me!!!

The TGV is awesome! ("Train a Grand-Vitesse" or "high speed train)

I only wish we had the TGV (or soon to come AGV) in California... (AGV=Automotrice a Grand-Vitesse, or high speed self propelled carriage)

:)

Tipster,

You are as biased as you can be....trust me, the buyers are MORE likely to get endless sales calls and materials by paying cash.

Frederick

What you are saying is that there is an overbidding war and the buyers have to sweeten the offers by saying "all cash"?

I doubt the market is that good

scorpio

No, that's not the case.

"All these rich people are making me depressed. Anyone know of a good, working "get rich quick pyramid scheme"?"

SF real estate. No wait, something is going on but we don't know what it is yet......

hi. not sure i follow this "all cash" thread. i was under the impression major lenders had stopped making individual residential mortgages at new developments unless > 60% of units had been sold. if only 15% of units are "sold" then the buyers MUST be paying all cash. and there's probly not many more where those came from. who's the lender on this project?

"Do you guys know what the average price/sqft of these apartments are selling for?"

Average price psf can be misleading for the buyers' perspective. The difference of prices between different units is quite big. They start at mid $800 psf and go up as much as over $2000 psf. This project has something for everyone and not just the rich, unlike some say here.

I walked by Millennium and Infinity today for the first time in quite a while. Millennium is a shaping up beautifully, but it feels like such an office building to me. Both the exterior massing and the location. I just don't get why THIS project was chosen to be the height of luxury for the SF Market, and I really wonder a bit how it will all play out over time. I won't go into rants about the homeless on the streets below as some have - I do think things will improve over time. But irrespective of that, it doesn't feel to me like a compelling location to live in the short term. I think even when the building is completed it will feel like you're living in the middle of office canyons (particularly on lower floors).

It's only a few blocks to Infinity, but it's also a bit of a different world. You're almost on top of the water. You're surrounded by more residential properties. And you've got alot more in the way of shops and services already nearby. And the project, even if a bit Miami, at least feels like a residential building. I love the way the courtyard is developing, and it's great to see evidence of people moving in.

Oh, and I didn't walk as far as One Rincon. Yeah, it's only a few blocks....but it's just a few blocks too far. I think it will always feel like the suburbs, relative to the others. At least One Rincon looks better from the downtown view than from the south....

Curmudgeon, thanks for finally calling out the fact the emperor has no clothes. What I still fail to understand is why most (but not all) of our newest residential towers look more like office buildings than residences? People seem to be confusing "urban living" with living between a bus station and a company headquarters. Why must all of our new towers be boxes? Anyone who follows what is now going up in New York or Chicago knows that their new residential towers are not boxes, but instead are attempts at signature designs, not one of them is a box! I was just reading about the new 105 story Waldorf Tower residences in Chicago, which is near the new Spire, Trump, and CanyonRanchLiving towers, all of which are NOT office boxes, but we could do better in California.

Although Millennium is better designed than some, does any of the new residential towers have the grace or flair of past residential high rise buildings in San Francisco? I am not saying they should look gothic, or victorian, they should modern BUT at least look like someone lives there instead of works there. Where are the motor courts like at the Brocklebank? Where are the grand lobbys, the outdoor gardens, the interesting penthouses on the roof levels that have wrap around balconies?

Could these become the slum towers of the future 60 years from now? History has plenty of examples of what happens to modern, mechanical, anonymous towers of the past over time. 50 years ago we put the poor into high rise housing, now in a strange turn of events, the poor are in the neighborhoods, and the rich are living on top of eachother in the dark canyons of the center of the city. Urban History is strange indeed.

If some of you will remember this property was slated for mix use- office, residential, and maybe hotel? Until it became strictly condominium during the late, great SF residential building boom. The design reflects that of a mix use building rather than strictly residential (There are absolutely no balconies at all!)

"Particularly when you can walk across the street and take the "TVG" to Beverly Hills in 2+ hours."

I love the TGV. Too bad this is America so rather than buying a proven foreign built train/techonology, we will pay billions more to some American company who will take ten times as long to build a first generation bullet train for ten times the cost which will go half as fast.